Makes me mad

[Delock]

Re: Makes me mad

darbex,

when is the next jr. republican meeting?

post more later ...out on site

mark thank you for your comments

[marauder_77868]

Re: Makes me mad

I welcome criticism...but calling someone a mass murderer is a bit over the top. Please define murder....seriously. I'd be curious to see that one. Comparing Republicans to Nazis, Stalinists, and the like was expected...it's a common enough tactic of the left. What I was trying to say was you can't call a commander-in-chief a mass murderer and expect not to have a negative effect on the troops. So that's at odds with saying you're supporting the troops. If you don't like the fact that we went to war, you have the option to voice your opinion. I'm just saying it's reckless and irresponsible to call the soldiers' commander a mass murderer. I'm not defining a level of patriotism. I'm defining a certain action as unpatriotic. I'm not saying don't be critical....I'm just saying love our country and support our troops in such a way as to temper your criticism so that it is constructive...not destructive. I have to go back to the airport in a bit for another round of fish...but I'll check in on this from time to time.

[marauder_77868]

Re: Makes me mad

darbex,

when is the next jr. republican meeting?

delock...

When is the next socialist party meeting?

[Nickintex]

Re: Makes me mad

delock...When is the next socialist party meeting?

Count me in. Oh wait, Delock did not want my support.  

Charles Jones, remind me to throw one of guy geeks flipflops at you (I don't own any myself) next time I see you! :P

[wesleydnunder]

Re: Makes me mad

And Charles isnt referring to your dislike his policies as not supporting the troops what he is referring to is that if you think that Bush is a mass murderer and wants to go out and kill everything not America then by that reasoning then the troops that are working hard in many of their eyes to protect America are nothing more then the mass murderers that their commander is. That is what correct me if I am wrong is his issue with what was said.

I don't buy this arguement either. The troops didn't have any choice where they were sent. In a firefight, you shoot back at who is shooting at you. I don't believe Bush wants to kill everyone who's not American. That statement is rediculous on its face. Is he a mass murderer? That question will be answered by history; we still don't have all the data. If, however, he took us to war under false pretenses, in the process killing Americans and other nationalities, then he is by law and definition, a murderer.

Mark

I've been trying to avoid this but I have to remind everyone that "Our President, George W. Bush" did not take us/US to war. He proposed we go to war and "Our Senate" made a majority vote for a Joint Resolution to use US Forces in Iraq. So with that fact in place, here is the list people to hold accountable.

U.S. Senate Roll Call Votes 107th Congress - 2nd Session

as compiled through Senate LIS by the Senate Bill Clerk under the direction of the Secretary of the Senate

Vote Summary

Question: On the Joint Resolution (H.J.Res. 114 )
Vote Number: 237 Vote Date: October 11, 2002, 12:50 AM
Required For Majority: 1/2 Vote Result: Joint Resolution Passed
Measure Number: H.J.Res. 114
Measure Title: A joint resolution to authorize the use of United States Armed Forces against Iraq.
Vote Counts: YEAs 77 NAYs 23

Vote Summary By Senator Name By Vote Position By Home State

Grouped By Vote Position
YEAs ---77
Allard (R-CO)
Allen (R-VA)
Baucus (D-MT)
Bayh (D-IN)
Bennett (R-UT)
Biden (D-DE)
Bond (R-MO)
Breaux (D-LA)
Brownback (R-KS)
Bunning (R-KY)
Burns (R-MT)
Campbell (R-CO)
Cantwell (D-WA)
Carnahan (D-MO)
Carper (D-DE)
Cleland (D-GA)
Clinton (D-NY)
Cochran (R-MS)
Collins (R-ME)
Craig (R-ID)
Crapo (R-ID)
Daschle (D-SD)
DeWine (R-OH)
Dodd (D-CT)
Domenici (R-NM)
Dorgan (D-ND)
Edwards (D-NC)
Ensign (R-NV)
Enzi (R-WY)
Feinstein (D-CA)
Fitzgerald (R-IL)
Frist (R-TN)
Gramm (R-TX)
Grassley (R-IA)
Gregg (R-NH)
Hagel (R-NE)
Harkin (D-IA)
Hatch (R-UT)
Helms (R-NC)
Hollings (D-SC)
Hutchinson (R-AR)
Hutchison (R-TX)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Johnson (D-SD)
Kerry (D-MA)
Kohl (D-WI)
Kyl (R-AZ)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Lieberman (D-CT)
Lincoln (D-AR)
Lott (R-MS)
Lugar (R-IN)
McCain (R-AZ)
McConnell (R-KY)
Miller (D-GA)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Nelson (D-FL)
Nelson (D-NE)
Nickles (R-OK)
Reid (D-NV)
Roberts (R-KS)
Rockefeller (D-WV)
Santorum (R-PA)
Schumer (D-NY)
Sessions (R-AL)
Shelby (R-AL)
Smith (R-NH)
Smith (R-OR)
Snowe (R-ME)
Specter (R-PA)
Stevens (R-AK)
Thomas (R-WY)
Thompson (R-TN)
Thurmond (R-SC)
Torricelli (D-NJ)
Voinovich (R-OH)
Warner (R-VA)

NAYs ---23
Akaka (D-HI)
Bingaman (D-NM)
Boxer (D-CA)
Byrd (D-WV)
Chafee (R-RI)
Conrad (D-ND)
Corzine (D-NJ)
Dayton (D-MN)
Durbin (D-IL)
Feingold (D-WI)
Graham (D-FL)
Inouye (D-HI)
Jeffords (I-VT)
Kennedy (D-MA)
Leahy (D-VT)
Levin (D-MI)
Mikulski (D-MD)
Murray (D-WA)
Reed (D-RI)
Sarbanes (D-MD)
Stabenow (D-MI)
Wellstone (D-MN)
Wyden (D-OR)

If Bush hadn't pushed for war, do you think our senate would have? Every time he could get in front of a camera we heard about "weapons of mass destruction; weapons of mass destruction; nukular weapons, chemical weapons; nukular weapons". This propaganda campaign went on for months prior to the vote you quoted. By the time he called for the senate to act, the propaganda machine had whipped most of the country, and certainly all but a few republicans, into a nationalistic frenzy. We went to war because our President wanted to, no matter at whose feet we choose to lay the blame.

What started out as a war based on the still unfound weapons of mass destruction. When they were never discovered, it turned into a humanitarian effort, to liberate the poor people of Iraq from a bloodthirsty dictator. Whatever. We've got genocide going on right now in Africa. Who's asking for us to go to war in Africa? Not Dubya. Meanwhile, we're not making headway in Afghanistan, and just invaded an area of Pakistan. Have we caught Bin Laden seven years after we invaded Afghanistan? Not so's you'd notice.

Mark

[ImaGuyGeek]

Re: Makes me mad

And Charles isnt referring to your dislike his policies as not supporting the troops what he is referring to is that if you think that Bush is a mass murderer and wants to go out and kill everything not America then by that reasoning then the troops that are working hard in many of their eyes to protect America are nothing more then the mass murderers that their commander is. That is what correct me if I am wrong is his issue with what was said.

I don't buy this arguement either. The troops didn't have any choice where they were sent. In a firefight, you shoot back at who is shooting at you. I don't believe Bush wants to kill everyone who's not American. That statement is rediculous on its face. Is he a mass murderer? That question will be answered by history; we still don't have all the data. If, however, he took us to war under false pretenses, in the process killing Americans and other nationalities, then he is by law and definition, a murderer.

Mark

I've been trying to avoid this but I have to remind everyone that "Our President, George W. Bush" did not take us/US to war. He proposed we go to war and "Our Senate" made a majority vote for a Joint Resolution to use US Forces in Iraq. So with that fact in place, here is the list people to hold accountable.

U.S. Senate Roll Call Votes 107th Congress - 2nd Session

as compiled through Senate LIS by the Senate Bill Clerk under the direction of the Secretary of the Senate

Vote Summary

Question: On the Joint Resolution (H.J.Res. 114 )
Vote Number: 237 Vote Date: October 11, 2002, 12:50 AM
Required For Majority: 1/2 Vote Result: Joint Resolution Passed
Measure Number: H.J.Res. 114
Measure Title: A joint resolution to authorize the use of United States Armed Forces against Iraq.
Vote Counts: YEAs 77 NAYs 23

Vote Summary By Senator Name By Vote Position By Home State

Grouped By Vote Position
YEAs ---77
Allard (R-CO)
Allen (R-VA)
Baucus (D-MT)
Bayh (D-IN)
Bennett (R-UT)
Biden (D-DE)
Bond (R-MO)
Breaux (D-LA)
Brownback (R-KS)
Bunning (R-KY)
Burns (R-MT)
Campbell (R-CO)
Cantwell (D-WA)
Carnahan (D-MO)
Carper (D-DE)
Cleland (D-GA)
Clinton (D-NY)
Cochran (R-MS)
Collins (R-ME)
Craig (R-ID)
Crapo (R-ID)
Daschle (D-SD)
DeWine (R-OH)
Dodd (D-CT)
Domenici (R-NM)
Dorgan (D-ND)
Edwards (D-NC)
Ensign (R-NV)
Enzi (R-WY)
Feinstein (D-CA)
Fitzgerald (R-IL)
Frist (R-TN)
Gramm (R-TX)
Grassley (R-IA)
Gregg (R-NH)
Hagel (R-NE)
Harkin (D-IA)
Hatch (R-UT)
Helms (R-NC)
Hollings (D-SC)
Hutchinson (R-AR)
Hutchison (R-TX)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Johnson (D-SD)
Kerry (D-MA)
Kohl (D-WI)
Kyl (R-AZ)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Lieberman (D-CT)
Lincoln (D-AR)
Lott (R-MS)
Lugar (R-IN)
McCain (R-AZ)
McConnell (R-KY)
Miller (D-GA)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Nelson (D-FL)
Nelson (D-NE)
Nickles (R-OK)
Reid (D-NV)
Roberts (R-KS)
Rockefeller (D-WV)
Santorum (R-PA)
Schumer (D-NY)
Sessions (R-AL)
Shelby (R-AL)
Smith (R-NH)
Smith (R-OR)
Snowe (R-ME)
Specter (R-PA)
Stevens (R-AK)
Thomas (R-WY)
Thompson (R-TN)
Thurmond (R-SC)
Torricelli (D-NJ)
Voinovich (R-OH)
Warner (R-VA)

NAYs ---23
Akaka (D-HI)
Bingaman (D-NM)
Boxer (D-CA)
Byrd (D-WV)
Chafee (R-RI)
Conrad (D-ND)
Corzine (D-NJ)
Dayton (D-MN)
Durbin (D-IL)
Feingold (D-WI)
Graham (D-FL)
Inouye (D-HI)
Jeffords (I-VT)
Kennedy (D-MA)
Leahy (D-VT)
Levin (D-MI)
Mikulski (D-MD)
Murray (D-WA)
Reed (D-RI)
Sarbanes (D-MD)
Stabenow (D-MI)
Wellstone (D-MN)
Wyden (D-OR)

If Bush hadn't pushed for war, do you think our senate would have? Every time he could get in front of a camera we heard about "weapons of mass destruction; weapons of mass destruction; nukular weapons, chemical weapons; nukular weapons". This propaganda campaign went on for months prior to the vote you quoted. By the time he called for the senate to act, the propaganda machine had whipped most of the country, and certainly all but a few republicans, into a nationalistic frenzy. We went to war because our President wanted to, no matter at whose feet we choose to lay the blame.

What started out as a war based on the still unfound weapons of mass destruction. When they were never discovered, it turned into a humanitarian effort, to liberate the poor people of Iraq from a bloodthirsty dictator. Whatever. We've got genocide going on right now in Africa. Who's asking for us to go to war in Africa? Not Dubya. Meanwhile, we're not making headway in Afghanistan, and just invaded an area of Pakistan. Have we caught Bin Laden seven years after we invaded Afghanistan? Not so's you'd notice.

Mark

8O That is one fantastic story. You and CF should get together and capture all of your thoughts in writing. I am certain there is plenty of money to be made from such creativity.  

You guys crack me up. I love the way there is always some new conspiracy to account for people not having to be responsible for their own actions. Now even the Reps and the Dems who voted for the war are victims      

Okay, I get it but where does (queue evil music) **** Cheney and Halliburton (echoes) play into this? You guys haven't worked him into the equation yet.   :think: And CF has only briefly touched on the New World Order. Surely there have to be some black choppers involved???

[Nickintex]

Re: Makes me mad

Charles (ImaGuyGeek), can I borrow your man slides to throw at someone? My Keen predator sandals were a little to costly to use as projectiles!

[ImaGuyGeek]

Re: Makes me mad

Charles (ImaGuyGeek), can I borrow your man slides to throw at someone? My Keen predator sandals were a little to costly to use as projectiles!

You got it Nick

[marauder_77868]

Re: Makes me mad

Charles...I missed Obama's name in your list. Oh....wait....that's right....I almost forgot....he's an inexperienced newcomer and wasn't a senator then.
Mark....to answer your question which I didn't do before...I didn't serve in the military...I wasn't aware that was a requirement to this discussion. I was, however raised in a family that was, for the most part career military. That's where my formative years were spent. That's my perspective.

[Nickintex]

Re: Makes me mad

Now launching man slides! :o
Oops, looks like I missed!  

[alexarae]

Re: Makes me mad

And Charles isnt referring to your dislike his policies as not supporting the troops what he is referring to is that if you think that Bush is a mass murderer and wants to go out and kill everything not America then by that reasoning then the troops that are working hard in many of their eyes to protect America are nothing more then the mass murderers that their commander is. That is what correct me if I am wrong is his issue with what was said.

I don't buy this arguement either. The troops didn't have any choice where they were sent. In a firefight, you shoot back at who is shooting at you. I don't believe Bush wants to kill everyone who's not American. That statement is rediculous on its face. Is he a mass murderer? That question will be answered by history; we still don't have all the data. If, however, he took us to war under false pretenses, in the process killing Americans and other nationalities, then he is by law and definition, a murderer.

Mark

I've been trying to avoid this but I have to remind everyone that "Our President, George W. Bush" did not take us/US to war. He proposed we go to war and "Our Senate" made a majority vote for a Joint Resolution to use US Forces in Iraq. So with that fact in place, here is the list people to hold accountable.

U.S. Senate Roll Call Votes 107th Congress - 2nd Session

as compiled through Senate LIS by the Senate Bill Clerk under the direction of the Secretary of the Senate

Vote Summary

Question: On the Joint Resolution (H.J.Res. 114 )
Vote Number: 237 Vote Date: October 11, 2002, 12:50 AM
Required For Majority: 1/2 Vote Result: Joint Resolution Passed
Measure Number: H.J.Res. 114
Measure Title: A joint resolution to authorize the use of United States Armed Forces against Iraq.
Vote Counts: YEAs 77 NAYs 23

Vote Summary By Senator Name By Vote Position By Home State

Grouped By Vote Position
YEAs ---77
Allard (R-CO)
Allen (R-VA)
Baucus (D-MT)
Bayh (D-IN)
Bennett (R-UT)
Biden (D-DE)
Bond (R-MO)
Breaux (D-LA)
Brownback (R-KS)
Bunning (R-KY)
Burns (R-MT)
Campbell (R-CO)
Cantwell (D-WA)
Carnahan (D-MO)
Carper (D-DE)
Cleland (D-GA)
Clinton (D-NY)
Cochran (R-MS)
Collins (R-ME)
Craig (R-ID)
Crapo (R-ID)
Daschle (D-SD)
DeWine (R-OH)
Dodd (D-CT)
Domenici (R-NM)
Dorgan (D-ND)
Edwards (D-NC)
Ensign (R-NV)
Enzi (R-WY)
Feinstein (D-CA)
Fitzgerald (R-IL)
Frist (R-TN)
Gramm (R-TX)
Grassley (R-IA)
Gregg (R-NH)
Hagel (R-NE)
Harkin (D-IA)
Hatch (R-UT)
Helms (R-NC)
Hollings (D-SC)
Hutchinson (R-AR)
Hutchison (R-TX)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Johnson (D-SD)
Kerry (D-MA)
Kohl (D-WI)
Kyl (R-AZ)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Lieberman (D-CT)
Lincoln (D-AR)
Lott (R-MS)
Lugar (R-IN)
McCain (R-AZ)
McConnell (R-KY)
Miller (D-GA)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Nelson (D-FL)
Nelson (D-NE)
Nickles (R-OK)
Reid (D-NV)
Roberts (R-KS)
Rockefeller (D-WV)
Santorum (R-PA)
Schumer (D-NY)
Sessions (R-AL)
Shelby (R-AL)
Smith (R-NH)
Smith (R-OR)
Snowe (R-ME)
Specter (R-PA)
Stevens (R-AK)
Thomas (R-WY)
Thompson (R-TN)
Thurmond (R-SC)
Torricelli (D-NJ)
Voinovich (R-OH)
Warner (R-VA)

NAYs ---23
Akaka (D-HI)
Bingaman (D-NM)
Boxer (D-CA)
Byrd (D-WV)
Chafee (R-RI)
Conrad (D-ND)
Corzine (D-NJ)
Dayton (D-MN)
Durbin (D-IL)
Feingold (D-WI)
Graham (D-FL)
Inouye (D-HI)
Jeffords (I-VT)
Kennedy (D-MA)
Leahy (D-VT)
Levin (D-MI)
Mikulski (D-MD)
Murray (D-WA)
Reed (D-RI)
Sarbanes (D-MD)
Stabenow (D-MI)
Wellstone (D-MN)
Wyden (D-OR)

+1, I agree that alot of people overlook that fact or maybe they just chose not to know. I guess that it's easier to play the blame game than to explain.

[wesleydnunder]

Re: Makes me mad

If Bush hadn't pushed for war, do you think our senate would have? Every time he could get in front of a camera we heard about "weapons of mass destruction; weapons of mass destruction; nukular weapons, chemical weapons; nukular weapons". This propaganda campaign went on for months prior to the vote you quoted. By the time he called for the senate to act, the propaganda machine had whipped most of the country, and certainly all but a few republicans, into a nationalistic frenzy. We went to war because our President wanted to, no matter at whose feet we choose to lay the blame.

What started out as a war based on the still unfound weapons of mass destruction. When they were never discovered, it turned into a humanitarian effort, to liberate the poor people of Iraq from a bloodthirsty dictator. Whatever. We've got genocide going on right now in Africa. Who's asking for us to go to war in Africa? Not Dubya. Meanwhile, we're not making headway in Afghanistan, and just invaded an area of Pakistan. Have we caught Bin Laden seven years after we invaded Afghanistan? Not so's you'd notice.

Mark

8O That is one fantastic story. You and CF should get together and capture all of your thoughts in writing. I am certain there is plenty of money to be made from such creativity.  

You guys crack me up. I love the way there is always some new conspiracy to account for people not having to be responsible for their own actions. Now even the Reps and the Dems who voted for the war are victims      

Okay, I get it but where does (queue evil music) **** Cheney and Halliburton (echoes) play into this? You guys haven't worked him into the equation yet.   :think: And CF has only briefly touched on the New World Order. Surely there have to be some black choppers involved???

Spoken like a true Republican. When faced with uncomfortable facts, y'all resort to sarcasm. Gee...what a surprise.

But since you asked:
Ever wonder why Halliburton, KBR, Bechtel and a few others directly connected to members or family members of our current administration walked into the biggest no-bid T & M contract in history? Especially as they were completely unnecessary to the war. Let's see, WWI, WWII, Korea, Viet Nam....hmmmm, not a bunch of contractors in those. And now we have mercs in this war. Ever wonder why? We didn't need 'em before. Who were the first ones to benefit financially from our going to war? Arms manufacturers? And wasn't Bush Sr. connected to a conglomerate of the ten biggest weapons manufacturers in the US? No conspiracies, I'm sure all of this was coincidence. How about the first time we tangled with Iraq? We were helping our poor allies, the Kuwaitis. The fact that Bush Sr. owned a bunch of oil wells over there was another coincidence and had nothing to do with that conflict. When he got his wells back, he ceased operations to take Baghdad. So many lovely coincidences that surround these people. They must be the beloved of God or something, huh?

Mark

[marauder_77868]

Re: Makes me mad

Democrats, when faced with facts, often either get angry or respond with "All I know is..." and then try to insert what they would like to pass off as fact.

[Nickintex]

Re: Makes me mad

Democrats, when faced with facts, often either get angry or respond with "All I know is..." and then try to insert what they would like to pass off as fact.

:eh:
:badsmiley:

[Zulaab]

Re: Makes me mad

Did you know the worlds Richest man is a Democrat ?