Why do people push a baby state today?

[jeebus]

Quick question, just to turn the discussion back on course. How is what SF is trying to do different that how the local and federal enforce alcahol and tobacco laws. It could be said that while yes, cigarettes and alcahol are bad for children, that it is the responsibility of the parents and not the retailers to make sure their children don't buy and consume the products?

Tobacco contains know carcinogens. How many foods has the FDA let pass that also have known carcinogens? And it is not against the law for a minor to smoke. It is against the law however for any adult to "contribute" to a minor, via the sale of tobacco.

As for alcohol, the ATF is a throw back to prohibition and is nothing more than a cash-cow for the government. The rules are little different for minors and alcohol due to the dangers involved via intoxication.

Steven you really need to get out from behind the monitor and go see for yourself.

Yup. One would truly be appalled if they knew what was really going on in the real world when it comes to those living on government assistance.

[jeebus]

Out of the 59 million Americas that dont have health insurance. I seriously doubt that all have bling or boom!

But, we as Americans have become the most unhealthy country of them all. Fast food establishments are not looking at keeping us healthy only full. I take it everyone have seen the pictures of the happy meal that sat out for 6 months? If not I can post it. I wonder if they are teaching kids about the four basic food group!

Since when is it the job of Fast Food establishments to teach kids anything?

[jeebus]

Admittedly, not every American can afford it but that number is estimated to be below 8 million American Citizens. That is less than 3%

This is the truth in advertising that socialized health care proponants do not want you to know.

They just send you a massive bill that, depending on the severity of your emergency, you may never have the ability to pay back. Also keep in mind that the laws are written to make sure you receive this unaffordable health care if your emergency is severe enough. An example would be if you were badly injured in a car crash and rendered unconscious, whether or not you can afford it or not you will receive it, and you will be responsible for paying for it. ?

Are you suggesting all emergency medicine be free? Who's going to foot that bill?

[ImaGuyGeek]

LOL Charles. Years ago when my dad was raising us the welfare debate swept through the house and my mother asked my dad, "if we can't help those mothers that need help (and back then there were quite a few Vietnam widows with kids that mom wanted to help) then what would you do"? Dad was referring to permanent welfare mothers when he responded, " I'd give 'em each a dime." When I asked what a dime could do for the families dad replied, "Tell 'em to put it between their knees and hold it there and they can continue to receive help, but the first time that dime hits the floor, cut 'em off!"

Your comment about factories reminded me of that.

Mark

Your father sounds like a wise man. Glad I could make you smile.

[wesleydnunder]

I would also add that, if the babysitters in Washington (or any government) want to regulate what people buy and create a nanny state, then start with the people who need it. All the broke beggers out there on entitlements who need babysitters. Regulate what people can buy with welfare and food stamps.

I work hard and don't need anyone else to pay my bills or raise my kids so if I want a happy meal with a toy in it for my kids, leave me and McD's the F alone and go fix what my tax dollars are being spent on because if I see one more woman with a litter of little brats screaming in the grocery store buying cookies and sodas with a Food Stamp card (my money) Ima round up all those little paycheck babies from their idiot mama and sell em all to Madonna and Angelina and use the proceeds to get that broke a$$ baby factory fixed.

LOL Charles. Years ago when my dad was raising us the welfare debate swept through the house and my mother asked my dad, "if we can't help those mothers that need help (and back then there were quite a few Vietnam widows with kids that mom wanted to help) then what would you do"? Dad was referring to permanent welfare mothers when he responded, " I'd give 'em each a dime." When I asked what a dime could do for the families dad replied, "Tell 'em to put it between their knees and hold it there and they can continue to receive help, but the first time that dime hits the floor, cut 'em off!"

Your comment about factories reminded me of that.

Mark

[wesleydnunder]

The underlying issue here is that liberals/socialists/progressives HATE CAPITALISM. Anything done do regulate it can't be anything but a positive in their eyes and this is just one more convenient excuse.

I'm not sure it's that they hate capitolism, Charles. For many, and this is opinion, I think they just want it both ways. They want to be able to be rich and have lots of things, just want someone else to do the hard work.

Mark

[marauder_77868]

The underlying issue here is that liberals/socialists/progressives HATE CAPITALISM. Anything done to regulate it can't be anything but a positive in their eyes and this is just one more convenient excuse.

[ImaGuyGeek]

I would also add that, if the babysitters in Washington (or any government) want to regulate what people buy and create a nanny state, then start with the people who need it. All the broke beggers out there on entitlements who need babysitters. Regulate what people can buy with welfare and food stamps.

I work hard and don't need anyone else to pay my bills or raise my kids so if I want a happy meal with a toy in it for my kids, leave me and McD's the F alone and go fix what my tax dollars are being spent on because if I see one more woman with a litter of little brats screaming in the grocery store buying cookies and sodas with a Food Stamp card (my money) Ima round up all those little paycheck babies from their idiot mama and sell em all to Madonna and Angelina and use the proceeds to get that broke a$$ baby factory fixed.

[Darbex]

+1 very well put Mark. It's maybe mean but we need to cut people off and stop babysitting everyone.

[wesleydnunder]

Steven you really need to get out from behind the monitor and go see for yourself. In my job I'm continually required to perform inspections in public housing, at the food bank. Here's what I see:

Those who CHOOSE to, make a life out of handouts. I can't tell you how many times I've gone to the public housing units at 1 o'clock in the afternoon and had to wake the people up to do the inspections... and in the middle of summer it's 65F in the house. Someone else is paying for them to sleep all day with the AC blasting.

I drive by the food bank on wednesdays, the day the new donation trucks come in, and see the lines of new vehicles parked there waiting to get their free stuff.

Should the Gov't legislate whether McD's can sell a certain thing at their restaurants? IMO, no. That's doin' the job for the parents who won't do theirs. Let those folks who continue to have kids past their means to support them take care of them. If the kids don't make it, they don't pass on the genes they inherited from the inept parents who spawned them. I don't believe that you or I were put on this planet to be babysitter to the fellow humans who occupy the planet. If you feel that you were, by all means, babysit away, but don't try to make it law that I have to babysit with you.

Mark

[ImaGuyGeek]

okay, let me re-word for clarity....

you said this
"Because homeslice, most of the (not all) people out there begging for freebies and entitlement programs are not skimping on luxury items like game consoles, beer, smokes, rims, stereos, etc... but they want me (and the rest of the taxpayers which is only 47% of us) to pay for their health care, housing, food, etc..."
Which means, to me, that you believe more than 50% of the people using these entitlement programs are just on the take. Then you say that they are not skimping on luxury items, which means this is something you know for a fact since you didn't say anything like "I think" or "In my opinion"

you them immediatly follow it up with
"I can take you to ANY poor neighborhoods in Houston and those ghettos are lined with cars sporting 20inch rims, stereos booming, punks wearing chains. I can also take you to any trailer park in Conroe and show you all the 4x4's with $1000 lift kits and $2000 worth of mud tires."
This is the supporting statement you used to back up what I talked about above. Naturally, since you followed them one after the other, it appears that you are using the fact that those "ghettos are lined with cars sporting 20inch rims, stereos boomin, punks wearing chains" as evidence of your above claim

Then you followed that with
"A member/friend is a Firefighter in the ghetto and more often than not he tells us about going on a call to the projects and going in and these people have 50inch flat screens, stereos and game consoles but call 911 to come and provide medical services because they don't want to go to the doctors and pay a bill or go to the hospital. "
This was your annecdotal evidance that tied it all together.

Yes, now you have quoted me and formed your opinion and assessment without misquoting me. Very good, but then I asked you to prove me wrong with a bet where I offered up $200 and a lawn mower.

So, prove me wrong. Introduce me to an honest, hard working, deserving person with no options but entitlement programs. Make me a believer.Because all the studies and information (as well as my personal experience) tell me that the majority of the entitlement beggers out there are ripping me off via my tax dollars.

[stevenallenbarnard]

okay, let me re-word for clarity....

you said this
"Because homeslice, most of the (not all) people out there begging for freebies and entitlement programs are not skimping on luxury items like game consoles, beer, smokes, rims, stereos, etc... but they want me (and the rest of the taxpayers which is only 47% of us) to pay for their health care, housing, food, etc..."
Which means, to me, that you believe more than 50% of the people using these entitlement programs are just on the take. Then you say that they are not skimping on luxury items, which means this is something you know for a fact since you didn't say anything like "I think" or "In my opinion"

you them immediatly follow it up with
"I can take you to ANY poor neighborhoods in Houston and those ghettos are lined with cars sporting 20inch rims, stereos booming, punks wearing chains. I can also take you to any trailer park in Conroe and show you all the 4x4's with $1000 lift kits and $2000 worth of mud tires."
This is the supporting statement you used to back up what I talked about above. Naturally, since you followed them one after the other, it appears that you are using the fact that those "ghettos are lined with cars sporting 20inch rims, stereos boomin, punks wearing chains" as evidence of your above claim

Then you followed that with
"A member/friend is a Firefighter in the ghetto and more often than not he tells us about going on a call to the projects and going in and these people have 50inch flat screens, stereos and game consoles but call 911 to come and provide medical services because they don't want to go to the doctors and pay a bill or go to the hospital. "
This was your annecdotal evidance that tied it all together.

[ImaGuyGeek]

no point was made.

The point I was making was...

"most of the (not all) people out there begging for freebies and entitlement programs are not skimping on luxury items like game consoles, beer, smokes, rims, stereos, etc... but they want me (and the rest of the taxpayers which is only 47% of us) to pay for their health care, housing, food, etc..."

[imagirlgeek]

and while D was the one who tied the two together (obviously pushing healthier food choices on kids today might make them more inclined to choose healthier ones in the future) immediatly after (and when I say immediatly after I mean the next post) guygeek started in with the talk about coach purses and laziness.

Fair enough. I can't say that guygeek doesn't go off on a tangent. And I am by no means saying that he's some sort of innocent victim. I wouldn't even attempt to say something like that, even if I wanted to! I was only trying to point out that the topics discussed here are absolutely polarizing, and we've obviously got people discussing these things and are looking at the exact same issues from completely different places. It all comes down to personal experience. Plus, guygeek uses A LOT of words (too many sometimes, IMO) and I've told him he doesn't use enough 'smilies' sometimes.

And in that post with D, GG was responding directly to the comment about 59 million Americans being without healthcare. I read D's post as him saying that whether or not a happy meal has a toy is really small potatoes compared to the bigger issue of so many people being without healthcare. We obviously read that differently. But that is a great example of how things can be so easily misunderstood here. Not saying that you misunderstood, just that one of us had too since we are reading the same words and getting completely different meanings from it.

Anyway, that's all I wanted to say. Carry on.

[stevenallenbarnard]

no point was made.