proposed budget of HLA

[guppymax]

So what would an annual budget look like? I bet this is not it.

ice, soft drinks and potato chips $15/month x 12 = $180
non profit organization fees                                   $100
FOTAS dues & travel expenses for delagate            $150

total                                                                    $430

max

[PhishPhreek]

Re: proposed budget of HLA

you need an estimated income before you can budget.  :?


estimated income
dues                  50
donations             0
auction %           12
show entry fees  50
T-shirt sales      100
              ---------
total income      212

budget expenses
FOTAS dues       12
incorporation    100
website               0
advertising          0
show prizes       20
meeting hall        0
T-shirts             80
                  ----------
total expenses  212

[guppymax]

Re: proposed budget of HLA

I object to dues or fees so the income is going to have to come from donations and auctions or T-shirt sales.

Someone said  to belong to FOTAS we have to send a delegate somewhere overnight. I have not heard much of an argument for joining FOTAS yet but I put it in the constitution and the budget so we could talk about it. If someone has to rent a hotel room and needs to eat and pay for gas the money has to come from somewhere.

Is incorporation different from the non profit fees? I think you at least used to be able incorporate a business for free. I think we need a better argument for becoming a non profit too.

Ken has pretty much promised the website for free.

Our membership is six already with no income or expenses so nothing for advertising sounds good.

I figure we can print certificates or make our own show prizes. I don't see why we should spend $20 on that.

Prosper has given us an open invitation to use Aqua Zoo to meet. He is trying to get a room ready for the meeting. We could always meet at resturants and the banks of bayous or members houses if we want. $0 for a meeting hall is reasonable.

T shirt sales don't look very lucrative  with your numbers but it would be fun to make them. I guess those iron on transfers that you print on a computer fade out pretty fast. I have some and I am going to try it.

We have to have potato chips and drinks don't we. I guess we could give up everything else. I would give up the potato chips and drinks before I would charge dues or fees.

I think it makes sense  to talk about the expenses first. Why would anyone donate if we don't need any money. If the expenses don't make any sense then the budget should be trivial.

So far only you and I have any interest in the clubs business.

estimated income

donations   100
auctions       10

total income 110

budget expenses

total expenses  0

It doesn't have to be balanced does it? If anyone wants drinks and potato chips let me know and as soon as we have income I will ask for an authorization for the expenditure online and we can vote on it?

OK but how can we procede with a constitution without addressing the non profit and FOTAS issues? Would it require an amendment to do either of these things later?

max

[PhishPhreek]

Re: proposed budget of HLA

You & I can spend more than we make..... sort of
but a club can't - it has to come from somewhere even if its a donation from your mad moneyl

The constitution should outline our goals...
why we want the club to do what ever we expect the club to do.

the budget should reflect the cost of those goals and
where the money is going to come from.

if the club wants to have ice and chips then the club has to figure out a way to get them...... fry potatoes and fill ice trays or have a fund raiser

the items and dolars I posted were just a "go by"
do we want to have shows ? with prizes ?
Do we want to have auctions, swap meets, social meetings, online auctions ?
Do we want to wear club t-shirts or hats to FOTAS or other club meetings ?
Do we want to make flyers or print cards to leave at LFS to attract newbies?
If we dont have dues or fund raisers then everything we want the club to do has to be funded by a donation..... I guess we could vote with our money....

if you don't want to do nothing then you don't need any money.

If you don't care where you're going then you aint lost.  :?

[guppymax]

Re: proposed budget of HLA

I don't think you and I should do all the deciding. We need more feedback from the membership. I think more info is needed on FOTAS. FOTAS has nothing to do with the constitution? The non profit thing is probably worth doing right the first time. From what I read some of the states easy do it forms are not available online for some reason right now. The IRS forms require more information but they require the state forms filled out first. They do require our goals spelled out and how we intend to implement them. They also require three board members at least 18 years old with addresses. I suppose those could be the officers. There is a fourth person and I am not sure if that could be one of the other three or not. It all seems more complicated than I am right now. I hope the forms do not conflict with our goals.

We could budget for refreshments and not buy them unless we make the money. We could budget for non profit fees and not file the forms unless we make the money. The constitution has to fit requirements to get the non profit status though. I will start rewritting the constitution again to include what I hope are the members goals and how we intend to implement them. It will say the HLA is a non profit because that is what the forms require even if the HLA may not be able to pay the fees.

If the HLA cannot raise the money it needs without dues and fees I prefer to do without.

max

[guppymax]

Re: proposed budget of HLA

I broke my arm and a leg a decade or so back and I was hobbling around the hospital with a crutch. One of the nurses ask me how I was doing real concerned like. I told her: "You can have a lot of fun with just one roller skate if you just have just one roller skate".  She really felt better. Fun doesn't have to cost much.

We haven't even had a meeting and I wonder if you mean you want to do it the IFGA way again. I think that would be great but I don't see how to get there from here. The HLA has to learn to crawl before it can walk. Do you want to talk about judges and classes and points and all that in the constitution? I thought I might do that when I write the constitution for the HGA, HMA, HSA, and HPA lol. Would it not be better to KISS and do that as amendments later? Maybe the crowd at the meeting will change my mind.

The objectives of the club are still very badly stated in the third draft.

I like the Do we want to's. Could you do more of that? At least mostly yes.

max

[PhishPhreek]

Re: proposed budget of HLA

incorporation papers have to be filed everytime you make a change.
ByLaws do not.

So I suggest the incorporation papers be bare bones with only what is required for a non-profit corp.  

"The purposes of this non-profit corporation shall be scientific, educational and social.   The members shall conduct research, publish results and host social gatherings to exchange information and support."

Then we can organize in the bylaws and make changes as necessary without having to pay fees and file papers everytime we want to change or add something.

So the question remains.... what do the members of the club want ?

[guppymax]

Re: proposed budget of HLA

Woops! I did not get the whole constitution posted for the third draft so I had to go back and edit it. Would you be willing to post some proposed incorporation papers? I have the 1023 and 1024 forms and instructions if you want I can email you a copy. Would you be willing to download the third draft of the proposed constitution notepad file and rewrite it and post the fourth draft. If so make the bylaws section and if you like maybe we need two more directors and/or officers to make sure we have the three or four needed directors. I think the constitution should not be only my creation. I think you know more about what I want at this point than I do and we still need to hear from the members. I could do a pole about budgeting refreshments and nonprofit status but its early yet. Maybe the FOTAS people will give us enough information to include that in a pole too.
We could pole other questions as well.

max

[guppymax]

Re: proposed budget of HLA

Proposed Budget

Budget Income

cash donations                                                   $100
auction donations                                                $217
auction commisions                                             $10

total                                                                   $327

Budget Expenses

ice, soft drinks and potato chips $15/month x 12 = $180
non profit organization fees                                   $100
FOTAS dues                                                         $12
inkjet cartridges                                                   $35

total                                                                    $327

[ken/mark]

Re: proposed budget of HLA

The budget looks good so far, but to begin with I think we can rotate on bringing the refreshments to the meeting because we have only have a dollar in the HLA bank.  We can bring them to the first meeting. later, ken

[guppymax]

Re: proposed budget of HLA

You are absolutely right the HLA cannot spend money it does not have even if the budget were approved. If the HLA found a better way to do something later an approved budget would not necessarily be a commitment to spend the money either. Having said that I think the budget should be as realistic as possible before we vote on it. I would say the same thing about the constitution.

Thank you for donating the refreshments ken/mark. Attaboy.

max