Cloudy Water Problem in a New Planted Tank

[puncak82]

@Navarro
Yes everytime I disturbed the amazonia substrate, it will make the water turn cloudy. I will do 1/3 water change everyday as you suggested. In the mean time, do I need to continue adding seachem stability? The tank is still cycling currently. What are the good stem plants beside rotala indica?

@Mzungu and kwc1974
I did 90% water change every 2 or 3 days on the first 2 weeks. For the rest of the week, I changed 50% every 3 days.
I used the original media that came with the eheim and they were new.
So far, I really like my wavepoint light. It is quit and give a good light output. The only downside is that it has only 1 switch for the light.

[Complexity]

I still want to rule out the rocks. Four weeks is a very long time to have that much water discoloration.

Puncak82, did you take the rocks out and do a water change? If the water with the rocks stays clear while the water in the tank continues to change color, then we can definitely rule out the rocks. I think it's important to narrow things down.

I also found this thread with a person having the exact same problem you're having. Read it all the way through, and see what happens when you try to crush it with your fingers.

http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=198174

A couple of other things I think you can do to narrow this down. IF your filtration is kicking up particles from the substrate, then turning the filtration off should allow it to settle. Give it a try and see what happens after 1 hour.

You could also take some of the substrate and put it in a clear glass. Add fresh water. Stir. Do you get the same brown color? If so, it's the substrate.

Given how long you've had this substrate and the water changes and filtration you've had on it, if it does turn out to be the substrate, I'd get a replacement. I know Aquasoil has a reputation for being messy, but not like this. It is unreasonable to think you'd have a planted tank without disturbing the substrate. We all disturb the substrate in the process of planting and uprooting plants. It's the nature of a planted tank. You cannot have a substrate that kicks up this kind of mess every time you work on your tank. If Aquasoil created this much of a mess every time for every person, more people would be complaining. This is simply unreasonable. You may have gotten a bad bag.

[Complexity]

Another thread with bad aquasoil which created the same problem you're having.

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/tank-journals-photo-album/94623-danepatricks-2-5-gal-journal.html#post926456

Someone suggested rinsing the aquasoil in a strainer to remove all small particles to clear it. Yikes. That's not good. I have a feeling the bag of AS you got was a bad batch.

[Complexity]

Okay, I'm convinced. It's the Aquasoil. I haven't read this thread all the way through, but it looks like a good one. Same problem. The guy got his cleared out.

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/general-planted-tank-discussion/80866-why-i-hate-aquasoil.html

Edit: Finally read all the way through the thread. Final conclusion was bad Aquasoil. I think that's what you're experiencing, unfortunately.

[Mzungu]

I still think that the final picture shows something other than AquaSoil cloudiness.

Ever left a bucket full of plants, or even a ziplock bag full of plants and water, for too long and forgotten about it? Remember what the color and consistency of the water looked like when you finally remembered those plants that you had forgotten? That last photo looks a LOT like that water, in color and opaqueness. I've had AquaSoil cloudiness before, but I remember it being more opaque than that photo, more "cloudy," if you will. That last photo looks like the AquaSoil cloudiness has cleared up quite a lot, but the plants are dying and melting and discoloring the water.

What's worked for me in the past is to use some fine filter floss in the filter.

But I agree, it's good to narrow things down, and always helpful to be able to isolate the cause.

[puncak82]

Yes I did put some of the rocks in the bucket last night. I will let you know the results tonight.

Thank you for all the links. I think I will stick with my 1/3 water changes everyday for now and see what happen. If this not working, I will put some gravels on top of the amazonia and seachem purigen on my filter as some people suggested.

[puncak82]

Update - I found out this evening that the water in the bucket still crystal clear. Hence, the rocks are not the one causing this. I am 100% positive now that I may have a bad batch of Aqua soil.
I did 1/2 water changed this evening and added couple more stem plants. Do I need to continue to dose Seachem stability? also, my KH reads 8dkh this evening. Do I need to lower this?

[Complexity]

Do I need to continue to dose Seachem stability?

No. This isn't a cycling issue.

also, my KH reads 8dkh this evening. Do I need to lower this?

No, leave it alone.

What I need for you to do is read the threads I posted links to. There's information in those threads that can be helpful in determining what's going on. For example, I'm still wanting to know what happens when you crush it as described at the end of the first thread I posted. I'm interested also in the grain size as mentioned in the threads. Or you could just cover the AS with gravel and be done with it, but that's not going to resolve the problem long-term.

[kwc1974]

Read the posts as complexity suggests, but at this point stop messing with the substrate. Stirring it up constantly will only compound the problem. I have dealt with "bad" batches of amazonia before, and in most cases it just takes patience and a little extra work.

DO a big water change, when the water is at its lowest re scape and re plant the tank (if you need plants Navvaro has offered to donate some and so will I between the two of us you can replant your tank) Once the tank is redone do not stir the substrate. It needs to settle. Per what your picture shows the Amazonia is leaching a lot of tanins. It is not the worse case senarios that have been seen in the threads before. I have had a bag of Amazoinia leech out tanins like this for about a year. It fades after a while but with no wood in the tank and still a slight brown tint to the water you can tell.

With a kh of 8 you are fine.

[puncak82]

Thanks for all the reply and offers. I will let you guys know when I need more plants.
kwc1974, how do you deal with the bad batches of amazonia in the past beside regular water change and not messing with the substrate? As some of the threads suggested sent by complexity, I plan to use Seachem purigen or cover the substrate with gravel.

[Complexity]

puncak82, if the AS you have breaks down easily when you crush it, then it may be an ongoing problem with no end in sight other than to cover it up and disturb it as little as possible. However, if it's stable, you might be able to rinse it out really well to get rid of enough of the broken down particles to make it reasonably usable. I can't tell without more information as to the character of the AS you have.

My concern is that planted tanks are not planted once and then left alone like planting a bush in your yard. It is normal to uproot and replant the plants frequently. As the plants grow, instead of cutting off the tops and leaving the bottoms in the tank, it's common to remove the bottoms out of the tank and replant the tops. That means the gravel on top will get mixed in with the AS, and the AS will constantly be disturbed as you care for your tank no matter how hard you try.

If that's the best that can be done, then so be it. But if it's possible to improve the situation, then it's best in the long run to try.

Another thought is to call HAW to see if you can exchange it for a good batch. I don't know if they can send it back to ADA or what. Ultimately, ADA is responsible to ensure that their product is what they advertise. If the batch you got truly is bad, then ADA should replace it. Since you didn't buy it directly from ADA, then you have to deal with the place you bought it from and have them deal with ADA.

[DiscusKid]

All my tanks that have been set up with Amazonia looked like that for a couple months, my 45-P has been set up for approx. 3 months and its just now cleared up. The 5.5 gal tank has been set up for a week and it is tea color right now, im going to get some polyester fiber(pillow stuffer) and try that see if it works.

BTW i got my AS from HAW too.

[kwc1974]

Thanks for all the reply and offers. I will let you guys know when I need more plants.
kwc1974, how do you deal with the bad batches of amazonia in the past beside regular water change and not messing with the substrate? As some of the threads suggested sent by complexity, I plan to use Seachem purigen or cover the substrate with gravel.

just keep up with the water changes and, it will go away.....sorry for the slow responce. If you want, use puregin or carbon or any other remedy that is used for removing tannins from the water.

[puncak82]

Update: As suggested by some members, I put Seachem purigen on my filter. The water in my tank begin to clears up along with regular water changes every other day. I will post some pictures later when the water clears up. Special thanks to Luis, Vicki, kwc1974 and Mzungu for all the help and suggestion.

[puncak82]

Update:
I keep doing water changes every 3 days. The water is still a little bit cloudy but it gets better everyday. My water parameter:

PH = 6.4
KH = 8
Temp = 77F
Ammonia, Nitrite = 0
Nitrate = 10
Co2 injected 3bps - 8 hrs/day
216w T5 HO light (2 - 6700k, 2 - 12000k) - 8 hrs/day
Amazonia and power sand

I have dwarf hairgrass, glossotigma, and rotala indica in the tank. The hairgrass grows like weed, but the glosso and rotala were not growing at all and started to die. I do not know what causing this.

Any help would be really helpful.