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**Mzungu** · 12-02-2010, 08:30 AM

For how long has this tank been set up? How long have you had the current fish? Any recent additions?

The fact that you have detectable ammonia leads me to think it's a newer tank and still cycling, but since you have nitrates also, this is puzzling.

Have you checked your tap water for ammonia/nitrites/nitrates? How about the date on your tests?

As for the scratching, that's usually the sign of external parasites, like ich. Many call it "flashing." The occasional scratch, like once a day, or a few times in a row but never again, usually just means that something's out of place and since fish don't have arms, they use what they can. :) But as often as you're saying they're doing it, I'd expect something is up. If you've added fish recently or they were all added at the same time but it's a new tank, chances are they came with whatever is ailing them.

A fully cycled tank shouldn't have any detectable ammonia, since the bacteria convert that to nitrite/nitrate. Water changes and plants are the only dependable way to reduce nitrates. (I wouldn't do live plants with Africans, though. :) )

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**Mzungu** · 12-02-2010, 08:31 AM

Sorry, forgot to add: your pH, if it stays at a stable 7.6, is perfectly fine. Better to have stability than to mess around with chemicals that alter the pH, and usually cause harmful and speedy fluctuations.

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**supadave** · 12-02-2010, 09:12 AM

Originally posted by Mzungu View Post

Sorry, forgot to add: your pH, if it stays at a stable 7.6, is perfectly fine. Better to have stability than to mess around with chemicals that alter the pH, and usually cause harmful and speedy fluctuations.

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+1

Stability is key .......... your water is fine for Africans .

**Andrew_B** · 12-02-2010, 10:06 AM

Thanks for the replys -

The tank has been set up close to 8months now. The main bulk of my current stock was introduced almost 2months ago. I have added a couple fish here and there in the meantime. Most recent was last week. Again, the real occasional scratching has been at it a couple weeks now.

I just did a test of my tap water:
Ammonia: 0.25
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 0

I was maybe thinking that there is a constant mini bio cycle going on at all times in my tank since ammonia is present, but I've yet to see any raised nitrites at all, unless the amount of ammonia is low enough to turn the nitrites into nitrates quick enough for me to notice... then my water changes just keep adding ammonia?

I'd still like to think it's not Ich, just for the reason that I keep my tank at "treating for ich" conditions at all time with the water temp and salt input.

Should I maybe skip a week of water changes and test again? I just added my two powerheads with sponge filters last night, so maybe they're be fine without a change slightly longer than normal.

**Mzungu** · 12-02-2010, 10:42 AM

Unless your test kit is old, the ammonia in the tap is almost definitely the cause of the ammonia in the tank and the higher-than-normal nitrates.

Man, that's annoying! Like you said, pretty much negates the worth of doing water changes.

I would think that not doing water changes would mean that the nitrates would still rise.

I also think that, like you said, your filter is equipped to convert the ammonia to nitrates pretty quickly, which is why you don't see any nitrites.

Maybe others will chime in with ideas on what to do. I've never had ammonia in my tap water (that I know of), so I'm lucky in that sense, but unfortunately can't help much, either.

What kind of substrate do you have? Lighting? I'm thinking what I'd probably do, which would be to add a few hardy plants to the tank.

I know there are some products out there that claim to remove ammonia, but since I'm not the best with chemistry, and since I've heard from some that these products just convert the ammonia into some other form that doesn't show up in your average test kit, I'm not sure if they're worth it.

Lastly, try to quarantine ALL new fish for at least a month before adding them to your established tank. It sucks to add a fish to your tank and have it infect everyone in there that you've had for years.

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**Andrew_B** · 12-02-2010, 11:13 AM

In terms of the test kit. I have an API master test-kit. Had it for a month or so now, been using the api quick dip strips before that. And honestly, both of my tanks have always given the same readings with this test kit. Maybe I should pick up some dip sticks as a second test method.

The water conditioner I use after water changes is Amquel plus. Claims to remove chlorine/chloramines/ammonia/nitrite/nitrate. Instructions say I can use it every day. Think I should try my luck and use a dosing every 48hours or so?

Substrate: Just plain gravel from petsmart (this is my first tank and didn't know any better at the time)
Plants: I use a couple plastic plants with cichlids being slobs.
Rock: ~100lb texas holey rock
Lighting: I use 2x 18" bulbs - 15 watt, T8, 8000k. The same bulbs as the LFS I go to uses in his tanks, really brings out the colors of fish... hopefully it's not hurting them!

I'll bring a sample of my tank water and tap water to the petco across the street to see if they're getting the same readings - not sure what's up!

**Andrew_B** · 12-02-2010, 12:38 PM

Just got back from Petco - They have the same readings as me with both tank and tap water. So yeah, my tap water having 0.25 ammonia in it is probably the cause of all my problems in tank.

I'm going to start off trying to chemically fixing the problems. I picked up Aqueon Ammonia Neutralizer to see how it works in my current tank water. Also picked up a carton of API ammo-chips and a nylon filter bag to place into a large container of tap water before introducing it into my tank.
It was also suggested to me to look into RO Units. They're expensive, but they look like they would get the job done. Anyone with experience with RO units? Do I need a second tank/place of storage for the new water? or is there a way to set it up to the aquarium itself and to where the new water goes straight into the tank after taking out the 20-25% water for a change.

In the meantime, I'm going to go a week without any water changes to see if the bacteria is able to fight the current ammonia in tank. At the same time, letting the ammo-chips chill in a bucket of water to see if they're able to eliminate ammonia before I introduce into tank.

Any other suggestions or people who have ammonia in tap water?
Thanks guys!

**fshfrk** · 12-02-2010, 02:26 PM

I live in Spring and since the change to lake Houston water I always have 1ppm ammonia in my water. The amquel plus will convert it to ammonium which is harmless and your bio filter can still break it down. Your test kit will still show ammonia but it should be harmless. To see if you truly have ammonia get one of these http://www.seachem.com/Products/prod...oniaAlert.html

**Andrew_B** · 12-05-2010, 12:30 AM

Hmm, I wonder if I'm thinking too hard about this. I still cant get below .25ppm ammonia, and ~60ppm nitrates. Just lost two baby blue-eye BN plecos today, probably due to water conditions. I'm thinking I may have to cut out like half the fish in my tank. I had high hopes of keeping an overstocked Malawi tank with me actually enjoying the maintenance part of keeping fish. Lots of fish requires lots of water changes, but in my case, those water changes are just re-adding the ammonia. I'd hate to do it, but if I had to, I do have a bunch of females and "runts" that I could part with to make sure my nice males stick around for a while.

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Nitrates = Potential scratching?

Nitrates = Potential scratching?

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