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Suggested Porcupine Puffer Setup?

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  • Suggested Porcupine Puffer Setup?

    A friend of mine has fallen in love with the little porcupine puffers that she saw at Aquarium World. Neither of us know salt too well and some research has told me to go with a minimum of 100 gallons of aquarium, FOWLR, and dont count on many if any other coinhabitants. I'm curoius if anyone has kept these fish for any length of time and can gove me an idea of a non-baller but well suitable setup? I was hoping to try out a little biocube 29 for something like this but that doesnt look to be the right thing to do...
    75G Standard - High Light Planted Community Fish
    28G Aquapod - Medium Light Planted Shrimp & Microrasboras
    12G Eclipse - Bonsai Planted Betta & Shrimp
    29G Standard - Vivarium w/ Red Devil Crabs
    45G Exo-Terra - Terrarium w/ Hermit Crabs (in progress)
    33G Cubish - Vivarium w/ D.auratus 'blue & bronze'

    GHAC Member

  • #2
    I used to have a Porcupine fish when I was into salt. I had him for a long time (2 years?). I had him in a 55 with no coral, dead rock with a little bit of live rock, a snowflake moray and a humu humu. He was one of my favorite fish I have ever owned. His name was Grover, and he was like a dog. Always at the front of the tank watching me. They are, from my experience, pretty hardy for a saltwater fish. The only thing you have to watch for with them is marine ich. For some reason, when everything seems fine, they will get it out of nowhere. Once one gets it, it is very hard to treat. The main reason being that I used to have good results by doing freshwater dips. Well, when you catch one of these and they are startled, they do what they do best. Inflate! There are chances of them dying when they do this if they cannot fully deflate, and if they do not, there are various sites that tell you how to assist them in doing so. As far as food, they LOVE brine and an occasional silverside. Like most aggressive fish, make sure you have a filtration system that can handle the bioload. Other than that, one of my favorites and they have a personality like no other. Oh, if you do get one, ask to see it eat first, and check their eyes well. Their eyes seem to be way more sensitive than other fish, probably because of their size and how much they protrude. Their eyes can get scratched easily while being transported from here to there. Just look for eye cloudiness and/or mucus coming off of the eye(s). Hope this helps, and good luck!
    65G African Tank (1 Ropefish, 1 Senegal Bichir, 3 Spotted Climbing Pearch, 2 Black Calvus "Zebra", 1 Featherfin Cat, African Knife, 2 Upside down Cats and an African Butterfly Fish.

    30G "The Mudhole" 3 African Mudskippers (Periophthalmus barbarus)

    20G 4 Longfin Zebra Danio, 2 Julii Cory, 2 Bolivian Ram, 1 Stripped Raphael and 3 Glass Cats.

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    • #3
      So wouldn't they inflate when you try to do a FW dip and then have an even harder time deflating in the FW? Are there other ways to prevent SW ick?

      Since a 4ft tank would be hard for her to place in her room, the working design I am looking at would be a 65 gallon RR tank with internal overflow, 40 gallon breeder sump, 300+gph protein skimmer, a 300W Ti Heater, Twin T5HO lighting Fixture (maybe cheap LED), Glass Top (since they are known to squirt water at you during feeding time), 1000gph return pump, 600-700gph circulation pump, sand substrate, 40# base rock, and 30# of live rock.

      Since the challenge with these fish is nitrates since they are messy, would it be a good idea to build up a rubbermaid drawer / potscrubber DIY trickle filter for more bio filtration? This would be easier for her to maintain over bioball media type wet/drys.

      Would it be worthwhile to set up more live rock / macroalgae / mangroves in the sump? What other equipment might be useful in the sump?

      Would you place mechanical filter media in the overflow?

      Are there any clean up crew critters that the PP wont eat?

      For this size aquarium would I need to set up terraces for the rock or just epoxy it together?

      Any suggestions on good bang for the buck skimmers, return pumps, circ pumps?
      75G Standard - High Light Planted Community Fish
      28G Aquapod - Medium Light Planted Shrimp & Microrasboras
      12G Eclipse - Bonsai Planted Betta & Shrimp
      29G Standard - Vivarium w/ Red Devil Crabs
      45G Exo-Terra - Terrarium w/ Hermit Crabs (in progress)
      33G Cubish - Vivarium w/ D.auratus 'blue & bronze'

      GHAC Member

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      • #4
        So wouldn't they inflate when you try to do a FW dip and then have an even harder time deflating in the FW? Are there other ways to prevent SW ick?
        Yeah, they inflate whenever they feel stressed… but, they’ll also inflate whenever they feel like it. It’s nothing to worry about and they usually deflate without issue. If they are “stuck,” you can lightly massage them to “burp” them. I had to do that on a couple of juveniles, I owned in the past, but they get “smarter” as they grow.
        There are several theories to preventing SW ich. UV sterilizers, garlic soaking their foods, good husbandry, large tank to prevent stress… etc… However, you really never know. Ich hits the best reefer, and when it does… all you can do is try to keep up. It’s tiresome, but can happen to anyone.

        I plan on doing a big FOWLR tank, myself. I will have 2 puffers in there. I also plan on soaking nori in garlic, 2-3 times a week, and feeding that to them. They chomp it down like a Vegan at Sweet Tomato! I, personally, believe that helps a lot. I also plan on doing UV and/or Ozone with my FOWLR. Main reason: clarity of the tank water, but I also believe that it helps. It only gets the free-floating ich in the water column, but every bit can’t hurt, IMO.


        Since a 4ft tank would be hard for her to place in her room, the working design I am looking at would be a 65 gallon RR tank with internal overflow, 40 gallon breeder sump, 300+gph protein skimmer, a 300W Ti Heater, Twin T5HO lighting Fixture (maybe cheap LED), Glass Top (since they are known to squirt water at you during feeding time), 1000gph return pump, 600-700gph circulation pump, sand substrate, 40# base rock, and 30# of live rock.
        1. That’s fine… just do what you can and know that you’ll need to transfer the puffer at a later date.
        2. Make sure that sump will fit. I’m sure a 29g would.
        3. I don’t understand your protein skimmer reference. Protein skimmers are “typically” not measure this way. It’s a numbers game with them… how big is the neck? What’s the air draw? What’s the wattage? What brand pump? Cylindrical or conical design, and are there visible seams in the body? Height of water required at the base? Footprint? Etc… For this setup, I wouldn’t do anything less than a SRO1000, a smaller SKIMZ, or even one of those Bubble Magus things. Try to avoid cheaping-out here, if you can. A good, used 200-300 dollar skimmer can last you years and familiarize you with what they actually do. They are the system’s heart and do more than just “pull gunk out.”
        4. You can get pretty cheap, reef rated lights, on Ebay these days. You obviously don’t really need much light for a FOWLR, though. Any old bulb system will do.
        5. Glass tops typically lock in heat and reef tanks put out more heat than FW setups. I would go for a screen top, and I would DIY it. It won’t stop the “spit” that you’ve heard about, but a little water on the floor is better than having a tank that is too hot. Plus, these fish jump.
        6. 1000gph return is too much. Just be sure to throttle it back with a gate/butterfly valve, or something.
        7. 600-700gph power head. Meh… I’d do that on both sides. Maybe just kick both of them on after feeding time, and keep one on all the time. Personally, I would just run them both all the time (save feeding).


        Since the challenge with these fish is nitrates since they are messy, would it be a good idea to build up a rubbermaid drawer / potscrubber DIY trickle filter for more bio filtration? This would be easier for her to maintain over bioball media type wet/drys.
        True. They can be very messy eaters. However, it really depends on what you feed them. If you want to treat them to some snails every now and then, expect to clean up the mess when they are done spitting out what they won’t eat. If you just feed nori, pellets, and stuff like “Rod’s Food” (I make my own food, personally), they really aren’t much different than any other fish.

        I wouldn’t worry about the post scrubbers, excess media, etc… I would probably want to do more biofiltration, but that’s just my preference. If you have a good skimmer (no reason not to, these days), you should be more than fine.


        Would it be worthwhile to set up more live rock / macroalgae / mangroves in the sump? What other equipment might be useful in the sump?

        Never hurts to add more biological filtration and macro, just research how to care for it. The more you keep in your sump, the less you’ll see in your display. If the macro starts dying, chances are you don’t have enough nutrients in the tank for it (and/or your skimmer is kicking *** and taking names!) Just watch out for dying macro. More live rock is “always” good practice. You’re tank is always better off with more live rock… I prefer to keep the majority of it in the sump, and keep a simplistic design for the DT.


        Would you place mechanical filter media in the overflow?

        Only if it wasn’t an eyesore…


        Are there any clean up crew critters that the PP wont eat?

        Good question! Short answer: No! Puffers are curious and will bite something simply out of curiosity. They may not eat a sea cucumber, but I don’t know if I’d risk that.


        For this size aquarium would I need to set up terraces for the rock or just epoxy it together?

        I would just stack it in a tank this size.


        Any suggestions on good bang for the buck skimmers, return pumps, circ pumps?

        On all of these, I would look for online deals on the forums. I wouldn’t buy anything new until I was in the hobby a bit longer. If you think about it, it’s really hard to justify paying full price for items your really don’t understand, yet. Not a bash, as I’ve been there; but you really need to exercise patience and find those online deals. They are out there…

        All in all, just have fun with it, and respond on how the fish is acting. If it seems stressed, you may need to take it back. Chances are, it'll be fine until it gets a bit bigger.

        Also, never believe what you read on these forums. I've known people to keep puffers in undersized tanks with "0" problems. It really depends on the caregiver in many cases.

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        • #5
          great answers, this give me enough to move forward a bit. i will look at used setups...i am kicking myself for not pouncing that 40 gallon breeder with the same size refugium setup the other day. i would use a 40/40 since i can custom build a stand that will acoomodate both

          what would be the minimum size for a 2-3" juvie puffer would be? there is a partucular one that she wants now that she has already bonded with at a fish store lol
          75G Standard - High Light Planted Community Fish
          28G Aquapod - Medium Light Planted Shrimp & Microrasboras
          12G Eclipse - Bonsai Planted Betta & Shrimp
          29G Standard - Vivarium w/ Red Devil Crabs
          45G Exo-Terra - Terrarium w/ Hermit Crabs (in progress)
          33G Cubish - Vivarium w/ D.auratus 'blue & bronze'

          GHAC Member

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          • #6
            I had one in a 20g for 4 months once. Just be sure to screen-off the top and keep the water as clean as you can. Also, as you know, 100g is the minimum people recommend for this fish. IMO, 180g is the minimum.

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            • #7
              i am assuming by 180 gallon min you mean for an adult? many sites cant seem to decide whether or not max size in captivity is 12 or 18 inches, so the 100 / 180 gallon variance seems logical. i am buying an aquapod 24 for shrimp but it may be a very temp home for the PP until i find a more suitable setup. I tried to talk her into a F8 or a GSP but she wants those big blue eyes lol.
              75G Standard - High Light Planted Community Fish
              28G Aquapod - Medium Light Planted Shrimp & Microrasboras
              12G Eclipse - Bonsai Planted Betta & Shrimp
              29G Standard - Vivarium w/ Red Devil Crabs
              45G Exo-Terra - Terrarium w/ Hermit Crabs (in progress)
              33G Cubish - Vivarium w/ D.auratus 'blue & bronze'

              GHAC Member

              Comment


              • #8
                That's understandable as they are very personable fish. If she's hooked now... just wait. :)

                Yes, 180g for an adult. You can just buy a new tank as it gets bigger, or rehome it. Not like they are hard to catch.

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                • #9
                  i had an idea to try feeding in a breeder box so i can collect the food particles, do you think thats theres any merit to trying that?
                  75G Standard - High Light Planted Community Fish
                  28G Aquapod - Medium Light Planted Shrimp & Microrasboras
                  12G Eclipse - Bonsai Planted Betta & Shrimp
                  29G Standard - Vivarium w/ Red Devil Crabs
                  45G Exo-Terra - Terrarium w/ Hermit Crabs (in progress)
                  33G Cubish - Vivarium w/ D.auratus 'blue & bronze'

                  GHAC Member

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I personally wouldn't. I guess you could put the food in the box, drop it in there, and s/he could swim in there, causing minimal stress to the fish... but, they're really not that bad. Their waste is more of a concern. Big eaters drop big... well... you know...

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                    • #11
                      cool, kinda looking at the CPR aquafuge and bak pak skimmer products. i have seen a couple aquapods sporting those now...so far the people with them seemed happy with them.
                      75G Standard - High Light Planted Community Fish
                      28G Aquapod - Medium Light Planted Shrimp & Microrasboras
                      12G Eclipse - Bonsai Planted Betta & Shrimp
                      29G Standard - Vivarium w/ Red Devil Crabs
                      45G Exo-Terra - Terrarium w/ Hermit Crabs (in progress)
                      33G Cubish - Vivarium w/ D.auratus 'blue & bronze'

                      GHAC Member

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Porcupine puffers are pretty hardy. If you have the tank for them, might as well stock it with other fish also. They aren't aggressive. You really won't be able to have a clean up crew. I heard they go after starfish. I have mine with a pencil urchin. They do spit when feeding them. To minimize, don't hold food over tank. I have mine in a 260g with no top and have never seen it attempt to jump out the water. They aren't really messy eaters unless you give them something they have to work for.

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