Need Help on Water Parameters

[Complexity]

Found it! Check out the links in this post. Hopefully, something will work for you.

http://www.houstonfishbox.com/vforums/showthread.php?p=405122#post405122

[Complexity]

I have two, but I'm using them.

They can be expensive if you get the fancy glass ones, but you can also make a DIY very inexpensively.

I posted some links with DIY instructions in another thread. Let me see if I can find it for you.

[DUHK]

Are drop checkers expensive? Where can I find a good kind? Do you have one?

[Complexity]

Understood. Thanks, Cichlid.

DUHK, you could use a drop checker which changes colors based on the level of CO2 in the water. Otherwise, you'll just have to check the mixture. After you've used it for awhile, you should start to get a feel for how long it lasts before you need to refresh the mix.

Regarding putting the CO2 into the filter intake, I've heard of people doing that with some reporting issues with their impeller long term. You'll probably be okay, but you might want to consider putting it in the output side of the filter. If you use a reactor or diffuser, you shouldn't have to worry about the CO2 dissolving into the water.

[DUHK]

Okay, great!

Wow, I have to say I've tried to read articles and "how to's" on the internet, but for the past couple of days I have learned so much from this forum!

Thank you guys! I love this community!

[cichlid1409]

you will know ...it will slow down significantly then stop producing bubbles .

[DUHK]

Speaking of carbon and stuff. I am trying to set up a DIY CO2 generator. How will I know once my CO2 supply runs out and I need to make more? I am putting my tubing into the intake of an internal filter.

[cichlid1409]

it's no problem. if your keeping tank raised cichlids from the fish store and you don't think you need one then you probably don't it's an added extra that us fish freaks NEED. when doing 80-90% water changes i think it gets a little more dangerous. there are plenty of people all over that just use dechlorinators and they are 'safe' to an extent. alot of us like the added insurance.

[Complexity]

I understand your ignorant (i mean this in the true definition and not to be rude) on the subject so i'll do what i can to help.

Absolutely no offense taken. I am ignorant on the subject, but am always willing to learn.

Good point about the WC fish and the level of concern. I am finding that there's almost a different culture of fish keepers, depending on what tanks and fish they keep. I have mostly talked with others with planted tanks where WC fish weren't an issue. In fact, many people with planted tanks are more into the plants than the fish. I'm mostly a fish person, myself.

So while I know enough to do pretty good with planted tanks and fish in general, keeping a tank of cichlids with nothing but rocks and sand is a new experience, and I'm finding that I have to start the educational process all over again.

I'm not ready to get a carbon filter today, but you have helped me to see the point in it all. I may switch over one day. In the meantime, I'm going to be much more careful to not overdose with Prime and watch my oxygen levels. If I graduate to keeping more rare and/or expensive fish, I will definitely reconsider the option of using a carbon filter.

I greatly appreciate all the info you've provided.

[cichlid1409]

Okay, just read the second link, but I don't see how that's pertinent to the discussion since I thought we agreed that the carbon filters you guys are using do not remove Fluoride. If that's the case, then any harmful effects, if any, of Fluoride on fish remains the same regardless of whether you're using a dechlorinator or a carbon filter.

So are we down to the issue of oxygenation and the byproducts issue?

you aked about fluoride that is just a link saying carbon doesn't really remove floride. just another thing to look at i guess. but IS fluride harmful thats the question..... 8)

[cichlid1409]

I understand your ignorant (i mean this in the true definition and not to be rude) on the subject so i'll do what i can to help.

1. the most deoxygenateion occurs with the release of sulfur ions into the water column where they pick up free floating oxygen molecules (deoxygenation) and exit the surface of the water ( the rotten egg smell). the amount of deoxygenation and its effect is all relative to how much dechlorinator you add , how much fish you have in your tank, the amount of oxygen your adding (bubbler, surface aggitation) and how much water you are changing at one time. FYI lack of oxygen to the brain causes brain damage. i included the formulas and all the whole numbers are moles so figure out how much a mole of each is and you can do the math. i am personally not that interested.

2. i don't remember all the exact compounds that were created as side effects and i didn't save all the links but sulfur and hydrochloric acid were two that i listed on the previous link. if you want google dechlorination and sodium bisulfite or sodium thiosulfate the 2 main dechlorinators used the first being the most common currently.

3. as far as being dangerous , you may not find a deffinitive answer to that question. the fact is we still use hormones on dairy cows and chicken that we eat and supposedly they are safe but i don't think so. it all boils down to take it out before hand (carbon) or leave it all in and turn it into other stuff that might possibly shorten the fishes life. Alot of people on here keep WC fish and chlorine and dechlorination by-products don't sound right for the money they spend on their 'babies'.

[Complexity]

Okay, just read the second link, but I don't see how that's pertinent to the discussion since I thought we agreed that the carbon filters you guys are using do not remove Fluoride. If that's the case, then any harmful effects, if any, of Fluoride on fish remains the same regardless of whether you're using a dechlorinator or a carbon filter.

So are we down to the issue of oxygenation and the byproducts issue?

[Complexity]

the blue ones are not organics they are metals . carbon will not remove metals. organics contain a carbon molecule.

I was just going down the list. I don't know how any of that stuff is affected by carbon or what the effects are to fish (other than that copper can kill inverts).

[Complexity]

Cichlid, I've only read the first of the two threads you posted so excuse me if this info is in the other thread. I'll read it next.

But I want to be sure I'm following this correct. There are two concerns about the new dechlorinators, (1) oxygen levels and (2) this comment, which was not detailed, "did you see all the other by products from the dechlorination prossess. SCARY!"

Does anyone know how much oxygen we're talking about? I'll admit that I've been lax with overdosing Prime, but that's always been with planted tanks so the plants may have maintained higher oxygen levels. However, I'm about to start up a cichlid tank with no plants. How much of an overdose does it take to kill the fish? 10%? 50%? 100%? 500%? Does anyone know?

As to the second part, where can I find the by-products list and the affects they have on fish?

Again, if this is in the second thread you listed, just ignore this because I'm about to read it now.

[cichlid1409]

Found the report on organics. http://www.sugarlandtx.gov/public_wo...ndaryConst.pdf

Bicarbonate - no
Calcium - no
Chloride - yes, in previous list
Copper - no
Iron - no
Magnesium - no
Manganese - no
pH - n/a
Sodium - no
Sulfate - ? it lists removal of Dimethylsulfate
Total Alkalinity as CaCO3 - n/a
Total Dissolved Solids - n/a
Total Hardness as CaCO3 - n/a
Zinc - no

the blue ones are not organics they are metals . carbon will not remove metals. organics contain a carbon molecule.