need help going to the dark side.

[paranoid1123]

my wife and i want to try out hand at SW we have a 10 gal tank that has been up and running for about a year now and the last 3 months or so it's had nothing in it.

i want to try our luck at sw, but i don't know how to start.

i have a heater, & a small hob filter on it now. just what do i need to do to get it ready for fish? i was thinking about buying a small powerhead and some live rock. but leaving the gravel i have in there.

do i need to change out the gravel to live sand or will the live rock take care of it?
i plan on keeping 1 clown fish, some crabs, maybe a starfish. i really don't know what to put into it, so any help would be great. it is a slandered 10 gal tank ( 20" x 10" x 12" ) LxWxH if i want to grow corals what type/kind of lightings do i need and what kind of coral?

do i need special water? my water is hard ie. liquid rock and high ph somewhere around the 8.4 range. i just built a carbon snake (thanks FSHFRK) but i haven't used it yet to see if it has helped w/ the hardness or ph.

so can some one help a noob out. a step-by-step wright-up on fw-sw setup would be great. also some good starter fish would be great just to get my foot in the door.

[algarciajr]

Post the same questions on www.marshreef.com, you may get a lot more replys there.

[thekarens]

First you need to have the appropriate substrate, then you need to us RO water with Marine salt and cycle the tank. Live rock and some live sand will help with that. A clownfish will quickly outgrow a 10g. If you get a baby it will work for awhile, but plan on upgrading. Be warned, with salt the bigger the tank the easier it is. Nanos are much more difficult to keep stable.

[cichlid1409]

substrate:
toss the gravel you've got and get either : live sand, dry aragonite sand or crushed coral

live rock:
on a setup like this i would suggest 1.5lbs of LR per gallon so about 15lbs
Filtration:
what is the HOB you have? you can run a hob with filter floss and purigen for a 10g a HOB rated for around 100-150gph is good. then get a small powerhead maybe a k1 or K nano.

Water:
If your using city water you will need an RO/DI unit. then mix the pure water you will get from this unit with a sea salt mix. the mix will buffer your water and add all necessary elements all you have to worry about is salinity which you will want at 1.025 sg. you'll need a hydrometer to measure this.

lighting:
depending on what type of corals you want to keep this will change....
low light corals 2-4 wpg - zoas, soft corals ie xenia and kenya trees, some lps
high light corals 6-10 wpg - sps, some lps

livestock :
do your research on which inhabitants you can keep together. if you want corals i would suggest against the starfish. a small percula clown will not get too big but other clown species will out grow this tank.

also check this out for some good reading

http://www.houstonfishbox.com/vforums/showthread.php?t=31946

[thekarens]

Even a true perc will outgrow a 10g though it will take some time.

As far as lights go it's not just wpg, it's the type of lights. You can't compare 20 watts of NO lights to 20 watts of MH or PC. It makes a difference. Salt doesn't work the same as a planted tank. Corals are animals and not plants.

If you do some research you'll do fine.

[Darbex]

I am going to do it the easy way on water and just buy the pre-made water from the fish store. I think MJ told me that you can buy it for about $1 a gallon. Which isnt bad if you consider all the time it takes to make it and what not and the cost of an RO/DI. So for your 10 gallon thats $10 to start and $1 - $2 for each WC.

[Darbex]

I thought a Perc gets about 3" why is that to big? Or is it because you need to keep a group of them?

[cichlid1409]

As far as lights go it's not just wpg, it's the type of lights. You can't compare 20 watts of NO lights to 20 watts of MH or PC. It makes a difference. Salt doesn't work the same as a planted tank. Corals are animals and not plants.

If you do some research you'll do fine.

i would agree its the PAR values you have to worry about but trying to keep it simple....

[semper]

if you don't want to buy live sand, toss the gravel

and leave the tank bare bottom, works well

don't over complicate your life, you don't need top notch equipment to have a successful tank, believe me i know

let me know if you need any help

[tnguyen]

if you don't want to buy live sand, toss the gravel

and leave the tank bare bottom, works well

don't over complicate your life, you don't need top notch equipment to have a successful tank, believe me i know

let me know if you need any help

I agree with you don't need top notch equipment to be successful. Though some will take the headache out if you choose wisely. That goes with fish only tank and planted tank. Part of the key is stability.

[myjohnson]

+ nothing wrong with a simple system. I have seen Omar's and it looks nice!

But I do have to say that some people just like nice toys.

nothing wrong with doing it either way really, it's all about personal preference.

[myjohnson]

my wife and i want to try out hand at SW we have a 10 gal tank that has been up and running for about a year now and the last 3 months or so it's had nothing in it.

i want to try our luck at sw, but i don't know how to start.

For more exact advice can you tell us what you want to keep? There seems to be three general type of set-ups: 1) live rock with fish one 2) SW planted tank and 3) reef tank.

i have a heater, & a small hob filter on it now. just what do i need to do to get it ready for fish? i was thinking about buying a small powerhead and some live rock. but leaving the gravel i have in there.

What type of HOB filter do you have on there? The AC110 and AC70 have been used with a lot of success on this size tank for reef tanks and fish only tanks. You can mod the filter and make it a refugium. You might not even need another powerhead if the HOB is a big one.

Like they have posted above (for corals or fish only) I would add around 1-1.5 pounds of live rock. I would personally use sand but I have seen many tanks without and it does fine. Keeps the water cleaner too.

do i need to change out the gravel to live sand or will the live rock take care of it?
i plan on keeping 1 clown fish, some crabs, maybe a starfish. i really don't know what to put into it, so any help would be great. it is a slandered 10 gal tank ( 20" x 10" x 12" ) LxWxH if i want to grow corals what type/kind of lightings do i need and what kind of coral?

Again follow the "general rules" on lighting posted above. The lighting you need depends on the corals you want to keep. I would get the 4 bulb t5 20'' or 24'' fixture for this size tank if you want to grow all kinds of corals. MH tends to produce to much heat.

do i need special water? my water is hard ie. liquid rock and high ph somewhere around the 8.4 range. i just built a carbon snake (thanks FSHFRK) but i haven't used it yet to see if it has helped w/ the hardness or ph.

Like Brian said, IMO for this size tank you don't need to buy an RO/DI unit or mix the SW. City Pets sells SW for .75 cents a gallon and .50 cents for RO/DI. You only have to change 10-20% a week. That's 1-2 dollars a week for both the SW and RODI water (for top off).

so can some one help a noob out. a step-by-step wright-up on fw-sw setup would be great. also some good starter fish would be great just to get my foot in the door.

This is a very general question and people have wrote books on the process.

If you narrow your questions down I would be able to do some step by step stuff for you.

Also, I have a lot links that will be a big help to you. But I don't have my latop right now. When I get it, I'll update with the links.

Good luck! Keeping SW can be rewarding. I like it cause there is just so much formoration out there. I just like reading about fish stuff. )

-mj

[tang-chaser]

Toss the gravel. You dont want to re cycle your tank when to add sand later. Its best to add your sand and as much live rock as you can when you start the tank. This will jump start your cycle and will also become your main filter. Adding a lot of rock later could push your tank to cycle again due to die off on the rock. So its best to do it right and get your sand and rock first. You can add rock later just make sure its cured and add little by little, just like you would do fish. You never want to push you bio filter over the edge. A good saying for saltwater tanks is that the faster you go the faster you fall. For fish only tanks you do not need a skimmer but i recommend one. I also recommend starting with a 40gal or larger for a saltwater tank. If you stick with the nano, you should think about adding a sump just to give the take more space for errors. As for my input on lights, its basically depends on corals. I use power compacts, and have 3.45 watts per gallon on my tank. I have soft corals, lps, and sps. They all grow and expand nicely. Because of my lower lit tank, i keep all my lps and sps in the top half of my tank. Also sps will give greater colors under hilides. Just do your research and you will be fine. Remember that we have all been through what your going through and made it just fine. If you have any questions just ask.

[Tiapan]

im going to second the going slow. i have been made to rush salt before (for clients) and even while warning them they say just do it and damn the consequences, let me tell you they aint pretty. lost fish, alge problems, disease problems, there are countless opinions on everything out there and salt tanks are no exception, but patience is very very important. i knew a person that kept just a pair of false percula clowns in a 5 gallon for years. they didnt have coral but did have a large mass of macro alge (bubble kind, forget the name) and some live rock and the tank did well, no issues. i like the green of several macro alge.
Ok here is my 2 cents for you setup.
I recommend live sand, i like the look (it cant be pricey though) and usually has lots of cool orginisms that you notice more in a smaller tank.

filter= at least double what would be necessary for fresh, i think an aquaclear 110 may be overkill (500 gallons an hour in a 10 gallon seems excessive even fore salt' though i like the mini refugium idea', i ran a 29 gallon salt for 6 years with a penguin 330 on it, i didnt have any problems), i really like bio wheels for smaller systems for extra aeration, and extra bio filtration.

Live rock is always good but starting with most of what your using and lettings it all settle is much better (like they said)

i have used tap mixed with salt for larger projects just fine, but in your case buying water might just be a whole lot easier, and more stable, plus less phosphates for alge problems

inverts are fun, active and less bio-load, plus there are lots of little shrimps and crabs that are really cool to me

There are tons of small fish that are very durable and colorful (mostly smallish gobies) they are some of the best salt fish i have ever kept, and have the least amount of problems, and most stay very small so great for that size tank.

if you dont want a ton of money going into the light setup, the right bulbs in normal light fixtures may be enough for low light corals like mushrooms and maybe some zoas, but t5 or compact flours would be much better, i agree that MH are a bit much for a ten.(read that as super overkill IMHO) (i like t5s but two bulbs is probably plenty for the low end corals in a ten, most reef keepers like lots and lots)

the truth is you can do a small salt, yes they can be harder to maintain, start up cost is much less though, it always pays to be patient (like waiting a while when a fish comes in at a store and giving it a week or two to make sure its not sick, and eating well.) and you can find great deals with people on this site and places like marshreef for both equipment and sometimes live critters.
Good Luck. i think i got everything i wanted to say out lol

[tang-chaser]

I agree wit tiapan. Dont get me wrong Saltwater tanks are easy to keep, but they can crash, and if they do, its a lot of $$$ lost. So its always better to do it write the 1st time. Always research a fish or coral b4 adding it to the tank. Take precautions when adding fish and corals to the tank. Corals can bring in aptasia, mojano, and algae into your system. Fish can bring in ick. Inspecting the tank that the frags/fish are coming from is key. And watch a fish for a while and check for good heath when buying. The longer you have the tank and the more it matures the easier it will become. Starting with one fish is great. Watch water parameters for a while, and if all is good add another. (just remember more fish means more nitrates) So then you add a sump with chaeto algae or better skimmer "boom" less nitrates. Add more fish. I never test my water anymore on a regular basis, other than calcium. Though every time i add fish or coral i test everything for about a week, just to be safe.